Legislature(2023 - 2024)GRUENBERG 120
03/24/2023 01:00 PM House JUDICIARY
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| HB68 | |
| HB66 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| += | HB 68 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED | ||
| += | HB 66 | TELECONFERENCED | |
HB 66-CONTROLLED SUB.;HOMICIDE;GOOD TIME DEDUC.
3:05:55 PM
CHAIR VANCE announced that the final order of business would be
HOUSE BILL NO. 66, "An Act relating to homicide resulting from
conduct involving controlled substances; relating to the
computation of good time; and providing for an effective date."
[Before the committee was the HB 66, as amended on 3/6/23.]
3:06:24 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD moved to adopt the proposed committee
substitute (CS) for HB 66, Version 33-GH1482\B, Radford,
3/20/23, as the work draft.
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY objected.
3:06:50 PM
JAKE ALMEIDA, Staff, Representative Sarah Vance, Alaska State
Legislature, on behalf of Representative Vance, provided a
summary of changes in the proposed CS for HB 66, "Version B",
which read as follows [original punctuation provided]:
Section 2 of the bill was amended to make delivering
a schedule IA, IIA, IIIA, or IVA controlled substance
to a person who is mentally incapable, incapacitated,
or unaware that a controlled substance is being
delivered misconduct involving a controlled substance
in the first degree (unclassified felony);
• Section 3 adds definitions associated with the
changes in section 2; and
• Section 4 creates an enhanced sentencing range of 7-
11 years for those who are convicted of delivering a
schedule IA controlled substance.
MR. ALMEIDA noted that Version B simply incorporated the
amendments adopted by the committee on 3/6/23.
3:09:10 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY expressed his concern about the changes
included in the proposed CS. He suggested that Version B
inaccurately reflected the amendments that were adopted on
3/6/23 and asked how off-record conversations among members had
resulted in the work draft before the committee.
3:10:01 PM
The committee took a brief at-ease.
3:10:49 PM
CHAIR VANCE explained that her intent by expressly listing the
drug classification - schedule IVA controlled substances - in
Section 4, as opposed to a specific drug, was to maintain
continuity in statute.
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY opined that a person who offered another
person an oxycodone pill should not be incarcerated for 7-11
years. He shared his belief that the scope of the bill should
remain on Fentanyl specifically. He expressed his strong
opposition to Section 4 in Version B.
3:12:57 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN recalled that during a previous hearing
on HB 66 the majority of the committee went into the chair's
office. He asked whether that conversation was covered under
the open meetings requirements.
CHAIR VANCE did not recall.
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN asked whether it was the House Majority's
contention that a majority of the committee could have an
offline discussion about the bill and that the conversation
would not be covered under the open meeting requirements.
CHAIR VANCE clarified that the discussion in question was with
the maker of an amendment. She said she was not an expert on
the Open Meetings Act, as the legislature did not fall under its
purview.
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN clarified that he was referring to the
open meetings requirement, which involved the legislature.
3:15:06 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY recalled that he had voted "yes" on both of
Representative Johnson's amendments; however, he did not vote in
favor of the changes included in Version B.
3:16:09 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN expressed his opposition to Version B, as
drafted. He shared his understanding that initially, Version B
was to include solely the amendments that had passed in
committee. He said the additional inclusions factored into his
opposition.
3:16:56 PM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Carpenter, C.
Johnson, Allard, and Vance voted in favor of the motion to adopt
Version B to HB 66. Representatives Eastman, Gray, and Groh
voted against it. Therefore, Version B was adopted by a vote of
4-3.
3:17:45 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY moved to adopt Amendment 3 to Version B,
labeled 33-GH1482\B.1, Radford, 3/21/23, which read:
Page 1, line 3:
Delete "relating to the computation of good
time;"
Page 4, line 24, through page 5, line 10:
Delete all material.
Renumber the followings bill sections accordingly.
Page 5, line 16, following the first occurrence of
"Act,":
Insert "and"
Page 5, lines 16 - 17:
Delete "and AS 33.20.010(a), as amended by sec. 5
of this Act,"
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON objected.
3:17:50 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY explained Amendment 3 would incentivize good
behavior and facilitate participation in drug treatment programs
by removing the "good time" ineligibility proposed in HB 66.
Ultimately, he argued, it was a cost savings measure, as
offenders would spend less time in prison.
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD opined that "good time" was unjustifiable
for these types of crime.
3:20:34 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN noted his skepticism regarding the use of
"good time" in Alaska Statutes. Nonetheless, he expressed
strong opposition to removing "good time" eligibility for an
offender who had no intention of harming another person.
REPRESENTATIVE CARPENTER remarked, "In my mind, good behavior is
to not do the crime in the first place." He shared his belief
that his constituents would not want him to support reduced
sentences.
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD expressed concern about showing leniency
to criminals, adding "we need to be harder, stricter, and the
punishment needs to fit the crime."
3:23:17 PM
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON expressed his hope that harsher
penalties and removal of "good time" would discourage drug
dealers from coming to Alaska. He opined that the bill should
be stricter. He remarked, "The death penalty wasn't available,
I didn't think this was the vehicle for it, but if it were, I
would have used it." He maintained his vehement opposition to
the proposed amendment.
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY opined that a death penalty sentence for
sharing a pill was too severe. He acknowledged the drug problem
in Alaska, reiterating that "good time" incentivized individuals
to participate in drug rehabilitation programs. He pointed out
that Amendment 3 was not lighter on crime; instead, it would
leave existing law intact, such that convicted drug offenders
would be eligible for "good time." He emphasized that addicts
needed treatment, as opposed to sending them to prison with no
hope of an early release date regardless of their behavior,
which was a disincentive.
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON maintained his objection.
3:26:39 PM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Eastman, Gray, and
Groh voted in favor of the motion to adopt Amendment 3.
Representatives Allard, Carpenter, C. Johnson, and Vance voted
against it. Therefore, Amendment 3 failed by a vote of 3-4.
3:27:09 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY moved to adopt Amendment 4 to Version B,
labeled 33-GH1482\B.2, Radford, 3/21/23, which read:
Page 1, line 1, following "substances;":
Insert "relating to manslaughter;"
Page 2, line 24, following "substances":
Insert "that contains or is combined with a
schedule IA controlled substance set out in
AS 11.71.140(c)(29)"
Page 2, lines 26 - 27:
Delete "; in this paragraph, "ingestion" means
voluntarily or involuntarily taking a substance into
the body in any manner"
Page 2, following line 27:
Insert new bill sections to read:
"* Sec. 2. AS 11.41.120(a) is amended to read:
(a) A person commits the crime of manslaughter
if the person
(1) intentionally, knowingly, or recklessly
causes the death of another person under circumstances
not amounting to murder in the first or second degree;
(2) intentionally aids another person to
commit suicide; or
(3) under circumstances not amounting to
murder in the second degree under AS 11.41.110(a)(6),
knowingly manufactures or delivers a controlled
substance in violation of AS 11.71.010 - 11.71.030 or
11.71.040(a)(1) for schedule IVA controlled
substances, and a person dies as a direct result of
ingestion of the controlled substance; the death is a
result that does not require a culpable mental state
[; IN THIS PARAGRAPH, "INGESTION" MEANS VOLUNTARILY OR
INVOLUNTARILY TAKING A SUBSTANCE INTO THE BODY IN ANY
MANNER].
* Sec. 3. AS 11.41.140 is amended to read:
Sec. 11.41.140. Definitions [DEFINITION]. In
AS 11.41.100 - 11.41.140,
(1) "ingestion" means voluntarily or
involuntarily taking a substance into the body in any
manner;
(2) "person", when referring to the victim
of a crime, means a human being who has been born and
was alive at the time of the criminal act. A person is
"alive" if there is spontaneous respiratory or cardiac
function or, when respiratory and cardiac functions
are maintained by artificial means, there is
spontaneous brain function."
Renumber the following bill sections accordingly.
Page 5, line 11:
Delete all material.
Renumber the following bill sections accordingly.
Page 5, line 14, following "Act,":
Insert "AS 11.41.120(a), as amended by sec. 2 of
this Act, AS 11.41.140, as amended by sec. 3 of this
Act,"
Page 5, line 15:
Delete "sec. 2"
Insert "sec. 4"
Delete "sec. 3"
Insert "sec. 5"
Page 3, line 16:
Delete "sec. 4"
Insert "sec. 6"
Page 3, line 17:
Delete "sec. 5"
Insert "sec. 7"
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON objected.
3:27:21 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY explained Amendment 4 would narrow the
charge of murder in the second degree to death caused by the
delivery and ingestion of Fentanyl or Fentanyl-laced narcotics
specifically. He indicating that the intent was to narrow the
scope of the crime match the original intent of the bill.
3:28:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON likened the proposed amendment to
being killed with a shotgun or a pistol, indicating that either
way, the result was death. He stated his opposition to
Amendment 4.
3:28:45 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN inquired about page 1, lines 5-6 of
Amendment 4.
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY did not know the answer.
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD asked Mr. Skidmore to explain Amendment 4.
3:30:07 PM
JOHN SKIDMORE, Deputy Attorney General, Criminal Division, DOL,
on behalf of the House Rules Standing Committee, sponsor by
request of the governor, provided a sectional analysis of
Amendment 4.
3:33:17 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD expressed her opposition to Amendment 4.
She stated that she was tired of weakening Alaska's laws. She
remarked, "We, as the state of Alaska, need to stop being used
as drug mules," opining that the focus should be on making the
state a better place.
3:33:53 PM
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN inquired about the impact of the language
on page 1, lines 19-20 of Amendment 4.
MR. SKIDMORE said the language in question was similar to
language used elsewhere in statute. The purpose, he said, was
to clarify that if Fentanyl was not present in the controlled
substance, it would revert to a manslaughter charge, as opposed
to murder in the second degree.
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY emphasized the rarity of a manslaughter
conviction in Alaska, reporting that DOL had achieved a total of
three in the state's history. He reiterated that the purpose of
Amendment 4 was to keep the bill focused on Alaska's Fentanyl
problem and discourage drug dealers from selling Fentanyl-laced
product.
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON maintained his objection.
3:36:56 PM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Groh, Eastman, and
Gray voted in favor of the motion to adopt Amendment 4.
Representatives Allard, Carpenter, C. Johnson, and Vance voted
against it. Therefore, Amendment 4 failed by a vote of 3-4.
3:37:30 PM
CHAIR VANCE invited Mr. Skidmore to provide closing comments on
the underlying bill, Version B.
MR. SKIDMORE stated that the bill was designed to address the
overdose problem in Alaska. He said he appreciated the
committee's focus on Fentanyl; however, statewide overdose
deaths were not caused by Fentanyl alone. He summarized
findings on the drug oversize mortality rates from the report on
Alaska drug facts and figures [included in the committee packet]
conducted by the Division of Public Health, Alaska Department of
Health (DOH). He indicated that the bill's drafting reflected
the administration's concern about Fentanyl in addition to other
substances. He encouraged the committee to pass Version B out
of committee in its current form.
3:40:11 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY moved to adopt Conceptual Amendment [5] to
Version B, such that "schedule 1A controlled substance" on page
4, line 20, would be replaced with "Fentanyl."
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD objected for the purpose of discussion.
3:40:39 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY explained that Conceptual Amendment [5]
would restore the language in Version B to reflect
Representative C. Johnson's original amendment to HB 66 [adopted
by the committee on 3/6/23].
3:40:55 PM
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON expressed opposition to Conceptual
Amendment 5, stating "murder is murder."
CHAIR VANCE explained that she had made the decision to include
the entire schedule of drugs, as opposed to just Fentanyl, on
page 4, line 20 over Version B, because schedule IA drugs were
treated similarly in other areas of law. She characterized
Fentanyl as the "drug du jour," adding that it was the
committee's responsibility to consider the impacts of
legislation far into the future.
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN opined that attempting to anticipate the
"drug du jour" of the future went against the very nature of the
legislature. He urged the committee to consider these
provisions in a thoughtful and deliberate manner rather than
delegating that authority elsewhere.
3:44:02 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY reiterated that the provision in question
was addressing the delivery of a schedule IA controlled
substances. He explained that without Conceptual Amendment [5],
a person could be sentenced to 11 years for sharing an Oxycodone
pill with a family member, for example.
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON maintained her objection.
3:44:48 PM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Groh, Gray, and
Eastman voted in favor of the motion to adopt Conceptual
Amendment [5]. Representatives Allard, Carpenter, C Johnson,
and Vance voted against it. Therefore, Conceptual Amendment 5
failed by a vote of 3-4.
3:45:27 PM
CHAIR VANCE invited closing remarks from members of the
committee.
REPRESENTATIVE C. JOHNSON declared a conflict of interest,
explaining that his nephew overdosed on a combination of drugs,
including fentanyl.
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD shared how her immediate family had been
impacted by drug use, an overdose death, and prison time. She
expressed adamant support for the passage of the bill.
REPRESENTATIVE CARPENTER relayed that his brother in-laws had
died from an overdose, opining that there was not a harsh enough
penalty for people who bring drugs into Alaska to profit from
other people's demise. He said there was compassion to be had
for addicts; however, he believed that the penalties for
bringing drugs into Alaska should be "as severe as humanly
possible."
3:49:14 PM
REPRESENTATIVE GRAY described the bill as being "dumb on crime"
instead of hard on crime. He recalled that the bill had been
presented to him as a "Fentanyl bill;" Instead, he said, the
bill would elevate the charge of manslaughter to murder in the
second degree, which would have affected three people in the
past 16 years. The second half of the bill would remove "good
time" eligibility for drug offenses, which was an excellent tool
for incentivizing people to become better people, he said. He
characterized the bill as a bad faith effort by DOL to lock up
addicts and deny them the treatment they need. He characterized
the changes in Version B as broad, dangerous, and expensive,
adding that it would give too much power to DOL.
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN opined that the bill sought to do away
with people's personal freedoms and liberties under the guise of
being tough on drug crimes. He shared his belief that the bill
was effectually "bastardizing the dictionary" in its expansion
of [second degree] murder. He discussed the politization of law
enforcement, opining that the bill would open the door for
similar conduct.
3:55:39 PM
CHAIR VANCE emphasized the dangerous nature of drugs, pointing
out that hundreds of Alaskans had died. She expressed her hope
that the bill would motivate people to reconsider their actions
by providing stiffer penalties. She remarked, "If someone dies
because of your actions that you knowingly participated in
there is potential for you to be charged with second degree
murder."
3:57:50 PM
REPRESENTATIVE ALLARD moved to report CSHB 66, Version 33-
GH1482\B, Radford, 3/20/23, out of committee with individual
recommendations and the accompanying fiscal notes.
REPRESENTATIVE EASTMAN objected.
3:58:13 PM
A roll call vote was taken. Representatives Allard, Carpenter,
C. Johnson, and Vance voted in favor of the motion.
Representatives Eastman, Gray, and Groh voted against it.
Therefore, CSHB 66(JUD) was reported out of the House Judiciary
Standing Committee by a vote of 4-3.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| HB 68 - Letters of Support (submitted 03-23-23).pdf |
HJUD 3/24/2023 1:00:00 PM HJUD 4/12/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 68 |
| HB 68 - Letters of Opposition (submitted 03-23-23).pdf |
HJUD 3/24/2023 1:00:00 PM HJUD 4/12/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 68 |
| HB 66 - v.B.pdf |
HJUD 3/24/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 66 |
| HB 66 - Amendment #3 (B.1) by Rep. Gray.pdf |
HJUD 3/24/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 66 |
| HB 66 - Amendment #4 (B.2) by Rep. Gray.pdf |
HJUD 3/24/2023 1:00:00 PM |
HB 66 |